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Glenn, What a cool experience! When we lived in Racine, WI, we TALKED about trying that little endeavor, but always chickened out… Nice to know it CAN be done! Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA N33431 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there.
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I can believe that. Last time I parked there I was in the boon docks and still paid 10 bucks a day. Thanks for sharing your cool adventure. best, craig – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -It also turns out that their overnight parking fee is less than what it would cost to park a car at O’Hare, even in remote parking. Glenn
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Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. Second, fees. A quick call to Signature at O’Hare revealed that this was going to be much cheaper than I ever thought. $20 handling fee (no gas purchased) and an $8.75 landing fee. Total with tax ~$35. Maybe a little pricey for some, but one of the cheapest life time dreams I have ever had.
I learned my lesson when I flew an archer into Laguardia last summer. My buddy said it was the closest airport so I obliged to pick him up there. What the heck I got my ppl in Memphis’ class Bravo and they never had a landing fee (landing fee? what’s that?). New York approach was quite obliging in vectors (they flew me almost over the world trade center!). Little did I know that I would be charged $116.00 landing fee plus $25 parking for each eight hour period! I did buy gas at signature- it was on special for $2.10/gal yippee! I learned ALWAYS call ahead. Ciao
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New York approach was quite obliging in vectors (they flew me almost over the world trade center!). Little did I know that I would be charged $116.00 landing fee plus $25 parking for each eight hour period! I did buy gas at signature- it was on special for $2.10/gal yippee!
New York airports are considerably cheaper during the "off hours". In some cases, it may pay to arrive a bit early. I know of one case in which a ten minute traffic delay on the Interstate made nearly $100 difference in the fees at Newark. George Patterson, N3162Q.
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Speaking of large airports, my instructor was telling me about the time he went to JFK in an Arrow. It was an IFR flight, so while being vectored over Westchester for the ILS(sorry, can’t tell you the runway), he noticed his COMM 1 was not behaving properly. Shortly there after it failed! Then, while on the final approach course, his COMM 2 failed! That’s right, he was in front of a 727 and both of his COMMS were dead. Fortunately, he had brought his handheld and the rest of the trip worked out,
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This is indeed a great story… I always chicken out and land at a feeder in NY/Chicago… Might I suggest this be posted to rec.aviation.stories? It’s a moderated newsgroup and I’ve yet to see a single post since subscribing last month… Good value to this one, entertaining to boot! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Glenn, What a cool experience! When we lived in Racine, WI, we TALKED about trying that little endeavor, but always chickened out… Nice to know it CAN be done! Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA N33431 Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there.
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Any aircraft can land at any airport in the United States. I’ve landed at O’Hare in a C172 – I was IFR and the controller kept moving me out to the right of the localiser to make way for jet traffic, and then he’d bring me back onto the localiser – different, but I was comfortable with it. I recall at a social function years ago a lady complaining about her United flight from SFO being delayed on departure by having to wait for ‘little planes’ to take off. I ignored the comment, but a very high time gentleman, ex traffic controller, ex airline pilot, currently working in sales for LearJet, made the spirited argument that a plane is a plane, and just because a group of people throw money in a hat and buy a bunch of planes and call themselves United Airlines is no reason why they should be given priority over you or me! And he was right – I agree with that argument. I used it once when I departed Vancouver for Calgary in my Twin Comanche and ATC vectored me north towards some weather (no deice on the plane) in order to fly clear of the jet traffic – I declined the clearance and requested another away from weather, and they wouldn’t give me one due to jet traffic. I objected, stated that I was an aircraft too, just as the jets were, and they should fly us together with me at a lower altitude for clearance (the area we’re talking about is about a hundred miles inland from the Vancouver controlled airspace) and they did it. You are entitled as an aircraft and pilot to fly anywhere, and you should assert that right – and gently tell the controller what YOU want – after all, you are the pilot in command, and you are entitled! Think it through logically, and then get in that plane and fly into ORD and enjoy the log book entry. Pat – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Glenn, What a cool experience! When we lived in Racine, WI, we TALKED about trying that little endeavor, but always chickened out… Nice to know it CAN be done! Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA N33431 Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there.
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Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. This turned out to be one of the easiest, lowest hassle flights I have ever taken.
<snip excellent story Congratulations, Glenn. You have landed and departed again without fuss from a true major airport. And you are correct. The controllers ARE professional and will treat you like any other professional flight. You eased your way considerably by doing your homework and by following the procedures correctly and by using your radio the way you are supposed to. All of that helps a lot. When you follow the procedures, a major airport can actually be easier to deal with an a small uncontrolled field with traffic! At O Hare surprises are the exception. At a small uncontrolled field, they seem sometimes to be the rule. Thirtyfive dollars for a brief landing and takeoff is expensive, but not outrageous. And it is a highlight in your logbook! <g HF
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Thanks for sharing your experience. Makes me dream. In Italy in no way are we general aviation pilots allowed near major international airports, let alone land there. And $35 is very cheap compared to the fees we pay. Riccardo De Nardis I-FFSV – Latina, Italy
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I learned my lesson when I flew an archer into Laguardia last summer. My buddy said it was the closest airport so I obliged to pick him up there. What the heck I got my ppl in Memphis’ class Bravo and they never had a landing fee (landing fee? what’s that?). New York approach was quite obliging in vectors (they flew me almost over the world trade center!). Little did I know that I would be charged $116.00 landing fee plus $25 parking for each eight hour period! I did buy gas at signature- it was on special for $2.10/gal yippee! I learned ALWAYS call ahead. Ciao
I flew to NY last year and saw what Laguardia was charging and went into the field just over the line in NJ Teterboro – they charged $6.00 landing and overnight. There are some fields that are priced for the commercial or business jets only.
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Second, fees. A quick call to Signature at O’Hare revealed that this was going to be much cheaper than I ever thought. $20 handling fee (no gas purchased) and an $8.75 landing fee. Total with tax ~$35. Maybe a little pricey for some, but one of the cheapest life time dreams I have ever had. As usual, Signature requires you to bring your own vaseline.
People bitch about the fees at Signature all the time, and I find them utterly reasonable (even cheap most times) given that Signature: a) tends to live at the large airports b) takes care of whatever you need within reason c) staff is generally more than friendly while doing b or collecting your fees Sure, I’d love if Meigs, OHare, Detroit Metro, and BWI had no landing fee, $1.56 100LL, and overnight parking of $5/night like some small airports. But, sometimes you’ve got to (or it’s most convenient) to use one of the medium/big airports, and I’m happy to pay the fees to do so. Signature is a business. Businesses need to make money in order to continue providing services. If no GA-friendly FBO existed at O’Hare, what would you do? Flying to Palwaukee and driving to O’Hare isn’t exactly my idea of "better" than paying $35 to Signature. —Jim
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Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there.
Great story. I learned to fly a Cherokee 140 at DuPage (DPA) in the early 1970’s, and often wondered what it would be like to go north a few miles and land at ORD. Out here in Arizona, you’d have to fight your way into Sky Harbor (PHX), and frankly you make it sound like ORD is just another (big!) airport. Thanks for sharing your experience. Rick Potts Phoenix, Arizona N32334 PA 28-151 Warrior
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Wonderful story Glenn! I’d love to see more adventures like this posted to the group. I remember reading a fun story on one of the sites dedicated to MS flight sim. The proprietor of the sight was a private pilot and shared his experience of flying his Katana into Meigs field. I wish I could find that story again as I remember I enjoyed reading it so much. The best line was (i have to paraphrase, can’t remember it exactly) was one controller’s response when told he had a Katana…"I’ve got a WHAT on my radar?" Jason
<snipped terrific story
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Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. This turned out to be one of the easiest, lowest hassle flights I have ever taken.
Great story Glenn, appreciate your sharing that with everyone, and hopefully letting people know that Class B’s, even the biggest of them don’t have to be that scary! On the contrary, while they can be somewhat brusque to someone who is lacking in their radio skills, they controllers at these places do tend to be the most capable and professional around. This isn’t their first job… I live just north of the Baltimore Washington Tri-Area Class B, and I have unfailingly found the controllers to be very professional and helpful to me. I’ve also heard them deny access to pilot’s whose radio skills were really really bad…but for average pilots with decent (not necessarily perfect) radio skills, they are excellent. As previously mentioned by others, landing at one of the big internationals is a great confidence booster, and is usually much easier than you think it will be. If you are unsure of yourself, get an instructor or more experienced pilot to do it with you. Is a lot of fun to mix it up with the ‘aluminum overcast’ on occasion. Brad Wood
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Thanks for sharing your experience. Makes me dream. In Italy in no way are we general aviation pilots allowed near major international airports, let alone land there. And $35 is very cheap compared to the fees we pay. Riccardo De Nardis I-FFSV – Latina, Italy
I agree. Here at Innsbruck (a small regional airport in Austria) you pay about this amount for a C150 (!!). A year ago I flew into LAS (MacCarran Intl. – Las Vegas) with a C172. It was a great experience and if you stick to the procedures and are well prepared, you will actually enjoy it. Just like in the earlier posting: in smaller (uncontrolled) fields, exceptions are the rule. greetings, Marty — LOWI http://www.hotze.com/pilot/ – the Austrian Airport Directory
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<snip I learned my lesson when I flew an archer into Laguardia last summer. My buddy said it was the closest airport so I obliged to pick him up there. What the heck I got my ppl in Memphis’ class Bravo and they never had a landing fee (landing fee? what’s that?). New York approach was quite obliging in vectors (they flew me almost over the world trade center!). Little did I know that I would be charged $116.00 landing fee plus $25 parking for each eight hour period! I did buy gas at signature- it was on special for $2.10/gal yippee!
Whoops! Check out DejaNews for my post concerning LGA tower and my visit there. I asked about GA and they said (smiling, but matter-of-fact) that they set the landing fees high enough to discourage us spam can jockeys from interfering with their busy airport. The guys at approach were probably laughing as they gave you vectors. OTOH, these guys will bust their dangly bits to make sure you get down in one piece if you have to declare. Cheers- m w grossmann PP-blah-blah-blah
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As usual, Signature requires you to bring your own vaseline. People bitch about the fees at Signature all the time, and I find them utterly reasonable (even cheap most times) given that Signature: a) tends to live at the large airports b) takes care of whatever you need within reason c) staff is generally more than friendly while doing b or collecting your fees
You’ve missed the key one. Signature has these fees only at airports where they are the SOLE way off the tarmac. They don’t get attempt this extortion when there is another FBO or a non-signature parking area. Sure, I’d love if Meigs, OHare, Detroit Metro, and BWI had no landing fee, $1.56 100LL, and overnight parking of $5/night like some small airports. But, sometimes you’ve got to (or it’s most convenient) to use one of the medium/big airports, and I’m happy to pay the fees to do so.
I don’t have any problem with landing fees, higher priced av-gas, or parking fees. What I have a problem with is the Signature "lack of competition" fee to walk through their building which is the only way to use the PUBLICLY FUNDED AIRPORT which they are controlling GA access to. Note at Dulles, Signature doesn’t play these games (although they will nicle and dime you to death for other fees). However at BWI you get screwed by them (in addition to the state of Maryland’s fees). I can’t burn enough gas getting up to BWI to buy enough gas to waive the $20 LOC fee.
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Try Teterboro – 15 mins from the heart of the city and a puny $11.00 landing fee. Your choice of FBO’s, and "black" taxis are generally 20% cheaper than in-city "yellow" ones for the return trip. Robin Thompson N240RT Cessna 421B
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Given the fact that Signature has to operate this facility on some very high rent land and the fact that most GA operators would never buy gas at their O’Hare operation and that Signature could very well price themselves out of ever having to deal with us if they chose, $35 is very reasonable. It also turns out that their overnight parking fee is less than what it would cost to park a car at O’Hare, even in remote parking. Glenn – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a multi-part message in MIME format. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. This turned out to be one of the easiest, lowest hassle flights I have ever taken. First, arrival and departure reservations. A quick call to AOPA pointed me to the AOPA airport guide with instructions on how to make slot reservations to get in and out of O’Hare. The phone system was easy to use and within five minutes, I had an arrival and departure slot reservation. In at 7:00 PM and out at 7:45 PM. Second, fees. A quick call to Signature at O’Hare revealed that this was going to be much cheaper than I ever thought. $20 handling fee (no gas purchased) and an $8.75 landing fee. Total with tax ~$35. Maybe a little pricey for some, but one of the cheapest life time dreams I have ever had. As usual, Signature requires you to bring your own vaseline. John – N8086N Wise man says "Never use a bank with the initials F. U." Are you interested in a professional society or guild for programmers? See www.programmersguild.org/american.htm Newsgroup: us.issues.occupations.computer-programmers EMail Address:
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a multi-part message in MIME format. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. This turned out to be one of the easiest, lowest hassle flights I have ever taken. First, arrival and departure reservations. A quick call to AOPA pointed me to the AOPA airport guide with instructions on how to make slot reservations to get in and out of O’Hare. The phone system was easy to use and within five minutes, I had an arrival and departure slot reservation. In at 7:00 PM and out at 7:45 PM. Second, fees. A quick call to Signature at O’Hare revealed that this was going to be much cheaper than I ever thought. $20 handling fee (no gas purchased) and an $8.75 landing fee. Total with tax ~$35. Maybe a little pricey for some, but one of the cheapest life time dreams I have ever had.
As usual, Signature requires you to bring your own vaseline. John – N8086N Wise man says "Never use a bank with the initials F. U." Are you interested in a professional society or guild for programmers? See www.programmersguild.org/american.htm Newsgroup: us.issues.occupations.computer-programmers EMail Address:
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Had a fantastic experience tonight. My wife needed to depart from O’Hare for a vacation in Key West and we live in Milwaukee, WI. How do we get her to O’Hare? After reading in this group about other people’s experiences flying into O’Hare, there was only one way to go. Let’s fly down there. This turned out to be one of the easiest, lowest hassle flights I have ever taken. First, arrival and departure reservations. A quick call to AOPA pointed me to the AOPA airport guide with instructions on how to make slot reservations to get in and out of O’Hare. The phone system was easy to use and within five minutes, I had an arrival and departure slot reservation. In at 7:00 PM and out at 7:45 PM. Second, fees. A quick call to Signature at O’Hare revealed that this was going to be much cheaper than I ever thought. $20 handling fee (no gas purchased) and an $8.75 landing fee. Total with tax ~$35. Maybe a little pricey for some, but one of the cheapest life time dreams I have ever had. Third, IFR or VFR. I was concerned that going VFR might mean lengthy arrival delays as I was sequenced into the busy arrival rush. However, the prospect of cruising in icy clouds for thirty minutes was not attractive. I elected to go VFR and we are off. Fourth, call O’Hare approach. Check with approach about 35 north of the airport to tell them I and inbound with Q for landing. I get a squawk, get radar identified and then the first potential glitch. Approach asks me to verify that I am inbound for landing at Palwaukee (10 north of O’Hare) to which I reply that is incorrect and that I am inbound for landing at O’Hare VFR. Approach responds with a polite but surprised "you want to land at O’Hare VFR? Give me a second to work that out." One minute later I am told to expect a visual to 9L. One or two very minor vectors and… Fifth, hand-off to tower. Tower asks if I have the airport in sight, I do. Tower clears me to land on 9L. I am a little shocked that it has been this easy, so I ask, "do you still want me on my present heading (180), or direct to the airport?". Tower replies, "direct to the field". Turn towards the field to line up for 9L and man is O’Hare one big, honking airport. It looks like I am about to land in a different county than where the tower is located. Sixth, landing. A United 727 gets asked to hold short for landing for, not so heavy, landing traffic. Grease a nice crosswind landing (winds 020 at 12G18) and a few seconds later I am told to take two right turns and contact ground. Now, what is potentially the most confusing part of the flight. Seven, taxi to Signature. Ground control proceeds to give me simple, efficient and progressive instructions to taxi to Signature. Man, is a 747 or DC10 big when viewed from the left seat of a Bonanza. A couple of small jogs to avoid causing traffic jams and I am about to get run over by an L-1011 that has just exited 4R. Ground asks me to stop and give way, which I am happy to do given the fact that I don’t think that the L-1011 passengers would even feel a bump as they rolled right over me. But, the ground controller has second thoughts and asks the L-1011 to stop and give way to me. Which they agree to do given the fact that when they discovered my Bonanza, during their outbound pre-flight walk around, stuck into one of those big tires like a nail picked up on the road, they would probably feel a little bit guilty. The ground controller then tells me to taxi in front of the big guy and says "I won’t make you eat dust tonight". Done the other way and I am sure I would have ingested a lot of dust and debris and probably have taken off in the blast from those three big jet engines. As I taxi by the big iron I can almost hear their thoughts, "Nice looking Bonanza, but what the heck is he doing here???" Eight, shutdown on Signature ramp. We are directed to a parking space on the ramp, whisked away in their van to pay the meager landing fee and given a ride to the terminal. Nine, back to Signature for departure. The van takes me directly from the terminal to my airplane. Couple of minutes later the prop is spinning and the ATIS is written down. Call clearance and request a VFR departure to the north and am instructed to maintain VFR at or below 1,800 and to monitor ground as I taxi out of the ramp area for my squawk code. Ten, taxi to runway. Ground picks me up coming out of the Signature ramp and gives me a squawk code and progressive directions to 32R. The route involves crossing the bridge that as a kid growing up in the Chicago area, I used to marvel at watching the big iron cross as we road into the airport to pick up yet another relative coming to visit. Just short of 32R, ground hands me off to…. Eleven, over to tower. Tower immediately clears me into position and hold on 32R. Here is the only real delay of the night. The tower controller is clearing commercial flights left and right to land and takeoff. I sat for 3-4 minutes on the runway waiting for departure, but did not mind one bit. It was fascinating listening to the ballet that was being orchestrated from up in the control tower. Cleared for take off, given a turn to the right and ten miles later tower tells me I am clear of the class B airspace and to squawk VFR. End of story… Don’t misinterpret the amount of my verbiage. This was easy to do and a great experience for any competent general aviation pilot. If there are any O’Hare controllers who read these groups my hat is off to you. Everyone I dealt with was professional, accommodating and did their level best to make sure that I fit into the system just like any other commercial flight at O’Hare. Thanks for the great experience… Glenn
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