Cessna Crash in Md.
Question:
: Sky, : : A similar media knee-jerk reaction took place in 1993 when 2 Cessnas : collided over Lincoln Park, NJ resulting in 1 fatality and several : injuries. CNN covered the accident and used this as a warning to : passengers of commercial aviation and, to a degree, all kinds of : aviation! Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill! Yes, but do they bother to cover all the auto accidents that mame/kill the riders? No. Selective, aren’t they? Anything for a buck. – Alan
Response:
I’m really disappointed with this thread. I expected *someone* to pipe up and say that the airports were at fault, even though the houses were built years later. But this thread is just a bunch of people agreeing that most people are morons. Why don’t the morons post??? It would be much more entertaining. — I don’t speak for the Federal Reserve Board, it doesn’t speak for me. pgp fingerprint: 10 49 F5 24 F1 D9 A7 D6 DE 14 25 C8 C0 E2 57 9D
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I’m really disappointed with this thread. I expected *someone* to pipe up and say that the airports were at fault, even though the houses were built years later. But this thread is just a bunch of people agreeing that most people are morons. Why don’t the morons post??? It would be much more entertaining.
Because all the morons hate airplanes, so they aren’t interested in getting on a discussion group about airplanes where they could learn our side of the story. It’s much easier to complain when you’re ignorant about the issue at hand. Allen Johnson
Response:
I’m really disappointed with this thread. I expected *someone* to pipe up and say that the airports were at fault, even though the houses were built years later. But this thread is just a bunch of people agreeing that most people are morons. Why don’t the morons post??? It would be much more entertaining. —
The airports were "at fault" for what? In the DC area, numerous fatalities occur every week on the Beltway — usually caused by someone else’s stupidity. An airplane usually wrecks due to mechanical failure. Did you think that pilot really wanted to hit a chimney –head on? The airport was built forty years ago — if you don’t like — MOVE! (Ken)
Response:
: Because all the morons hate airplanes, so they aren’t interested in : getting on a discussion group about airplanes where they could learn : our side of the story. It’s much easier to complain when you’re : ignorant about the issue at hand. cf. Bill Mulcahy |Rich Ahrens | Homepage: http://www.visi.com/~rma/ | | "Nobody talks more of free enterprise and competition and of the | | best man winning than the man who inherited his father’s store | | or farm." – C. Wright Mills |
Response:
Here’s another question. I’ve often wondered why Potomac and Hyde are so close together. I have my opinion, but does anybody know for sure why two airports were established so close?
Response:
I’m really disappointed with this thread. I expected *someone* to pipe up and say that the airports were at fault, even though the houses were built years later. But this thread is just a bunch of people agreeing that most people are morons. Why don’t the morons post??? It would be much more entertaining.
The morons can’t post. To post you have to be able to write. You also have to be able to read to realize you SHOULD post. Morons do neither, they just buy houses at the end of a runway and then complain that there are airplanes going overhead. John
Response:
I’m really disappointed with this thread. I expected *someone* to pipe up and say that the airports were at fault, even though the houses were built years later. But this thread is just a bunch of people agreeing that most people are morons. Why don’t the morons post??? It would be much more entertaining.
There may actually be one scenerio where the "airport" is at fault in this case, but the "airport" in question isn’t Potomac. Rumor has it that this plane had refueled at Hyde just before flying to Potomac, and Hyde has a bad reputation among some local pilots for selling contaminated fuel. It’ll be interesting to see the results of the NTSB investigation. — Reece R. Pollack CP-ASMEL-IA — N1707H Piper Arrow III (based GAI)
Response:
Y’know its funny My FBO (Wings field near Philadelphia) has one runway (24/6) which on the 24 end has a cornfield, on the 6 end has an industrial park has an enforced noise abatement procedure. We must turn to 255 after reaching 1300 MSL presumably to cater to the ‘established’ residences surrounding the airport. Well I don’t know, but there are lots of residences on the 255 track departing Wings, and I am damned if I know how much this decreases the percieved noise from those who live near the field. Actually I wouldn’t mind living near the airport myself…I could get to those early morning flight lessons with a little more sleep! Also, I notice that when departing Philly airport (PHL) during my business trips the ‘heavies’ must also turn to 255 for noise abatement just like I do! Okay, so they’re mostly departing on runway 27 and their airplanes are bigger, faster, and I’m not flying them but hey, I’ll take whatever minor fantasy I can get while I’m sitting in those long aluminum tubes! Oh well, a USAir pilot I spoke to not too long ago shares the same feelings regarding those who bought property near airports who complain about inadequate ‘noise abatement’ procedures and the fact that he has to slow his airplane to speeds which makes him uncomfortable during climbout. What can you do? Walker Walker J. Seestedt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – - – - – snip – - – - NEIGHBORS: Now the neighbors get on the camera a tell us how "dangerous" this airfield is – and they would like to see it shut down. The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the houses were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. This is the same argument you see that results in "noise- abatement" procedures being instituted at airports all over the country The airport was there for years and the people moving in squawk to the city, county or state authorities until they get the airport muzzled. Recent case in point – at the old Pease Air Force Base near Portsmouth, NH, the development authoritty advertised for aviation interests to bring their business to the airport. Once the planes got there, including a squadron (or more) of KC-135 tankers, the development authority had the city pass an ordinance that prohibits jet operations between 11:00PM and either 6:00AM or 7:00AM. On the subject of noise and its effect on people near an airport, there was a study conducted in England a number of years ago to determine what the objection really was. They found that the people living near the airport could envision a jet coming through their living room window every time they heard engine noise. The "noise- abatement" procedures instituted as a result of the complaints (turns at low altitude, reducing power right after takeoff, etc) are just the things that might, one day, contribute to an airplane coming through their living room window. (This study was reported on back in the early 70’s so the situation hasn’t changed.) Same as with the "dirty" jet engines of the late 60’s and early 70’s. The airlines had to retrofit their engines with "clean burning" burner cans. Subsequent investigation revealed that, although particulate emissions were decreased by a very significant amount, the amount of nirtous oxide emitted by the "cleaner" engines was 18 times greater that the "dirty" angines. Now, nitrous oxide can kill you, but, at least you won’t see the smoke. Do people ever change??? Lou.
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I have flown into and out of Potomac many times. It is a bit tricky. The field is located in a valley at the end of a relatively new subdivision. It is very hard to find in a car. It is near another GA field (Hyde) an all under the Washington, Baltimore, Andrews AFB Bravo space. Yes, the neighbors should have known that the field was there. It is a great place to learn how to fly. Howard Hammerman N3107T
Response:
– - – - snip – - – - NEIGHBORS: Now the neighbors get on the camera a tell us how "dangerous" this airfield is – and they would like to see it shut
down. The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the houses were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby.
This is the same argument you see that results in "noise- abatement" procedures being instituted at airports all over the country The airport was there for years and the people moving in squawk to the city, county or state authorities until they get the airport muzzled. Recent case in point – at the old Pease Air Force Base near Portsmouth, NH, the development authoritty advertised for aviation interests to bring their business to the airport. Once the planes got there, including a squadron (or more) of KC-135 tankers, the development authority had the city pass an ordinance that prohibits jet operations between 11:00PM and either 6:00AM or 7:00AM. On the subject of noise and its effect on people near an airport, there was a study conducted in England a number of years ago to determine what the objection really was. They found that the people living near the airport could envision a jet coming through their living room window every time they heard engine noise. The "noise- abatement" procedures instituted as a result of the complaints (turns at low altitude, reducing power right after takeoff, etc) are just the things that might, one day, contribute to an airplane coming through their living room window. (This study was reported on back in the early 70’s so the situation hasn’t changed.) Same as with the "dirty" jet engines of the late 60’s and early 70’s. The airlines had to retrofit their engines with "clean burning" burner cans. Subsequent investigation revealed that, although particulate emissions were decreased by a very significant amount, the amount of nirtous oxide emitted by the "cleaner" engines was 18 times greater that the "dirty" angines. Now, nitrous oxide can kill you, but, at least you won’t see the smoke. Do people ever change??? Lou.
Response:
Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about? This sort of stupidity is universal. People buy houses near airports and complain about the noise. They buy houses near farms or landfills and complain about funny smells. The bad thing is sometimes they can get a judge to agree with them.
Well, it never fails. It happens here in Bologna, Italy, too. People living near the airport keep complaining about the noise and are trying to stop a project for lenghtening the runway, which is one thing we really need. Those folks were perfectly aware that they were buying a *CHEAPER* house because it was situated near an airport and now they’re trying to have it all..! (Considering they’re far enough not to being exposed to the risk of being hit by some crazed plane missing the approach or the landing…) The stupidest proposal (opposing the lenghtening project) I heard was to build another airport of about the same size (or to increase the capacity of an existing one, I don’t remember well) on the other side of the town and split the traffic in two… yeah, we wanted a longer runway to have 747s land in with ease, and they suggest to cut it in half and make it land one part in airport A and the other in airport B…! What if I should land in airport A and my luggage in the other? 
The mother of jerks is always pregnant… bye, Nick
Response:
}It would be a shame if we lost Potomac. This airfield is one }of the best grass roots flying places around. Home to everything }from Ultralights to Apaches, and cheap fuel ($1.49/gal for 100LL) }and a freal friendly atmosphere.
Too bad. Your CONVENIENCE in carrying out your HOBBY is nothing compared to the SAFETY of local residents and their little CHILDREN. Why don’t you take up some hobby which isn’t so dangerous to the neighborhood, like basketweaving? Resistence is futile, you will be assimilated. — "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue."
Response:
It would be a shame if we lost Potomac. This airfield is one of the best grass roots flying places around. Home to everything from Ultralights to Apaches, and cheap fuel ($1.49/gal for 100LL) and a freal friendly atmosphere. I have to believe I know those houses, the street is right on the extended centerline of the runway with a small berm separating them from the field. I believe the end of runway 6 was moved back as a result of this development.
Response:
Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about? And how much damage can a Cessna do to a house? You’d have a better chance of winning the million dollar lottery than being injured or killed by an airplane from this airfield.
I am not a pilot (yet) but am reading books now, and am going to start flying with an instructor at the start of January. I don’t have a lot of input on the pilot/neighbor reaction, but I have a little. I live in Arlington, Washington about 5 miles from the site of the EAA fly-in site at the Arlington Municipal Airport. This is where I’ll be flying. The Airport was built during or before World War II and has an outstanding safety record. There is a large industrial park surrounding the airport that has been there almost as long. Developments have sprung up all around this industrial park, and now the neighbors complain about the noise. They fight to keep any big company from moving in, and refuse to let new roads get built. I could go on for hours about the assinine attitude of a lot of people, but I won’t because I think we’ve all been a *little* guilty of it. Some just a lot more than others. It’s the same syndrome that happens when people build houses in flood plains that have been that way since the beginning of time, and then want the government to do something about the flooding that wipes out their house every other damn year. I get sick of it! Of course, then they blame it on logging, Just my .02 cents. Thanks for listening. :) JB. (systemic)
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Sky, A similar media knee-jerk reaction took place in 1993 when 2 Cessnas collided over Lincoln Park, NJ resulting in 1 fatality and several injuries. CNN covered the accident and used this as a warning to passengers of commercial aviation and, to a degree, all kinds of aviation! Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill! Ed – N7025W
Response:
These comments apply to most airports around the world. The general public is pretty stupid most of the time. Remember, a politician was once heard to say that the level of student mathematic ability must be improved because half of them were below average. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about? And how much damage can a Cessna do to a house? You’d have a better chance of winning the million dollar lottery than being injured or killed by an airplane from this airfield. I just can’t believe the stupidity of some people! Is this a normal reaction of residents after a plane crash — or are the residents of Prince George’s County sort of "dense?" TO THE NEIGHBORS: Go ahead and move! Who cares? Any comments appreciated. Sky King
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You don’t understand… Most humans no longer posess the ability to rationalize and make their own decisions. Instead, they look to the media to bring up their "Fear-Of-The-Day" (patent pending), and the government to get rid of it.
Harg – You have an interesting name (sort of Viking-like, similar to Hagar), but you have it wrong here. People are better at "rationalizing" things than ever before; I suspect that you meant they are less competent at "reasoning" in making their own decisions, and I would probably agree with you there. Dan
Response:
After watching the news I’m a little upset so I thought I would vent my anger by posting this message about Stupidity by – neighbors – politicians – and the media!
(snip) The guy who owns the airport told the developer that it wasn’t a good idea to put houses up, but I guess greed got the better of the guy. Big surprise! I fly out of Lee airport near Annapolis, MD and we have the same kind of problems. Airport in operation since 1946 and houses MUCH newer at each end of the runway. Don’t tell me these people are that blind. "Oh, look honey. Won’t it be nice to have airplanes flying over us every day". They have the same problem that the censorship freaks have. On the TV and radio, there is a little thing called the on/off knob or the channel selector. They shouldn’t have moved there in the first place. And if they don’t like it now……MOVE! -john
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The guy who owns the airport told the developer that it wasn’t a good idea to put houses up, but I guess greed got the better of the guy. Big surprise! I fly out of Lee airport near Annapolis, MD and we have the same kind of problems. Airport in operation since 1946 and houses MUCH newer at each end of the runway. Don’t tell me these people are that blind. "Oh, look honey. Won’t it be nice to have airplanes flying over us every day". They have the same problem that the censorship freaks have. On the TV and radio, there is a little thing called the on/off knob or the channel selector. They shouldn’t have moved there in the first place. And if they don’t like it now……MOVE!
Hi, John, I also fly out of Lee. Are you in the Navy/Army club? Anyway, I’ve seen the photo (in the Pilot Shed?) of the early days of Lee Airport. Not much around but pasture. It was there long before all the developments. All is not gloom and doom though. My chiropractor has a house right by the airport, and he (and, he says, a number of others) support the airport. They believe that any other zoning of the land would cause increased traffic, noise, crime, accidents, deaths, etc. So not *everyone* wants to close it down. Although it seems the "close it down" crowd is often the more vocal. Ken Shrum PP-ASEL Annapolis, MD Lee Airport (ANP)
Response:
[...] : Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years : ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved : into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s : all the panic about? And how much damage can a Cessna do to a house? You’d : have a better chance of winning the million dollar lottery than being : injured or killed by an airplane from this airfield. : : I just can’t believe the stupidity of some people! Is this a normal reaction : of residents after a plane crash — or are the residents of Prince George’s : County sort of "dense?" This is nothing new. This is occurring at *many* airports around the country. Even though the airport may have been there long before there were any developments around them, there is suddenly this danger in their minds… even though they should have known the airfield was there when they moved in. If they didn’t, and they were truly concerned about a danger, then obviously these folks didn’t bother to investigate just where they were buying this house. – Alan
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After watching the news I’m a little upset so I thought I would vent my anger by posting this message about Stupidity by – neighbors – politicians – and the media! Two days ago a Cessna 182 crashed in Ft. Washington, Md., a suburb of Washington, D.C. The pilot had taken off from the Potomac Air Field and developed engine trouble. He tried to glide his plane into a small clearing but ended up crashing into the roof and chimney of a house in a subdivision. MEDIA: Here comes the media with their camcorders filming the crash site, along with interviews with the neighbors. NEIGHBORS: Now the neighbors get on the camera a tell us how "dangerous" this airfield is – and they would like to see it shut down. The woman who owned the house that was hit — said she was movong away because of the danger. POLITICIAN: Now here comes a Prince George’s County Council member, Jim Estep, telling everyone this was "an accident just waiting to happen" and that he is demanding a full investigation of the incident. BTW – The pilot walked away from the crash with a broken wrist and ankle, and there was "little" left of his Cessna. He was lucky to be alive. Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about? And how much damage can a Cessna do to a house? You’d have a better chance of winning the million dollar lottery than being injured or killed by an airplane from this airfield. I just can’t believe the stupidity of some people! Is this a normal reaction of residents after a plane crash — or are the residents of Prince George’s County sort of "dense?" TO THE NEIGHBORS: Go ahead and move! Who cares? Any comments appreciated. Sky King
Response:
Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about? And how much damage can a Cessna do to a house? You’d have a better chance of winning the million dollar lottery than being injured or killed by an airplane from this airfield.
You don’t understand… Most humans no longer posess the ability to rationalize and make their own decisions. Instead, they look to the media to bring up their "Fear-Of-The-Day" (patent pending), and the government to get rid of it. — Harg Tholan "Did you let a fluffy?" - Space Ghost
Response:
Here’s what really pisses me off: The airfield was built forty (40) years ago and the house were built about 10-15 years ago. These neighbors moved into their homes – knowing full well there was an airfield nearby. What’s all the panic about?
This sort of stupidity is universal. People buy houses near airports and complain about the noise. They buy houses near farms or landfills and complain about funny smells. The bad thing is sometimes they can get a judge to agree with them. John A. Limpert
Response:
After watching the news I’m a little upset so I thought I would vent my anger by posting this message about Stupidity by – neighbors – politicians – and the media! [snip] TO THE NEIGHBORS: Go ahead and move! Who cares?
It is exactly the same knee jerk reaction that we get from folks worried about the noise arround Dulles and National. Dulles was built out in the boonies specifically so it wouldn’t have neighbors. It was built sometime in the early 60s, and all the neighbors moved in during the 80s and 90s. Guess they didn’t know it was there, huh? Pat
